PRIME MINISTER
Engagements
Q1. Mr. Yeo
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 28 November.
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)
This morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today. This evening, I hope to have an audience of Her Majesty the Queen. Later, I shall have talks with President Roh of South Korea, who is on an official visit to this country.
[column 576]Mr. Yeo
Has my right hon. Friend noticed, following a 45 per cent. increase in real terms in spending on the National Health Service since 1979, that next year, for the first time in British history, spending on health by central Government will exceed spending on defence? Does she agree that this is very timely, in the light of recent international developments, and that it makes absolutely clear which party in the House is genuinely concerned about improving the National Health Service?
The Prime Minister
I agree with my hon. Friend. Next year spending on health in real terms will very nearly have doubled since we came to power. There are more doctors and more nurses, and more patients are being treated. It is a most excellent record, as is our record on defence. I noticed an article in a newspaper yesterday by a doctor who had not been of our political persuasion, but who said of our health reforms:
“An examination of each aspect of the reforms would lead most intelligent and informed people to see that they make sense.”
He also said:
“On health, Mr. Kinnock and his colleagues have nothing to offer.”
Mr. Kinnock
Is the Prime Minister aware that today's report from the National Audit Office shows that the Government sold Rover for at least £60 million less than it was worth? Will the Prime Minister now make a public apology for that gross incompetence?
The Prime Minister
Apart from the year in which it sold Jaguar, Rover had not made a profit since 1976. To privatise that company successfully was a major achievement and the Government struck the best deal that they believed possible in all the circumstances of the sale.
Mr. Kinnock
Does the Prime Minister not recall that it is the second time in two years that the Government have short-changed the British public by selling off assets? It happened with Royal Ordnance, it is happening with Rover and tomorrow it will happen on a monstrous scale with the sell-off of water. When are the Government going to stop asset-stripping the country?
The Prime Minister
No, Mr. Speaker. Rover-Leyland had not made a profit at all except in the year when it sold Jaguar. It was able to carry on only because of Government guarantees to trade creditors and to the banks. The liability mounting up on the British taxpayer was enormous. It was a good thing to privatise Rover under those circumstances.
Mr. Kinnock
Does the Prime Minister think that that excuses in any way selling off a company for £60 million less than it was worth?
The Prime Minister
If it was such a good bargain, why did not the TUC and the unions try to buy it first?
Mr. Carttiss
Will my right hon. Friend acknowledge that, although I was listed as one of the Tory rebels by the Radio 4 programme and have the honour to represent the constituency once represented by the distinguished Member who was the father of my hon. Friend the Member for Clwyd, North-West (Sir A. Meyer), I, my constituents and the British people demand that she remains—[Interruption].
Mr. Speaker
Order.
[column 577]The Prime Minister
I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I am sure that he and his constituents are both right.
West Yorkshire
Q2. Mr. Cryer
To ask the Prime Minister when she next expects to pay an official visit to west Yorkshire.
The Prime Minister
At present I have no plans to do so.
Mr. Cryer
Does the aspiring President for life and Prime Minister accept that if she visited west Yorkshire she would find extensive anger and resentment about water privatisation because, over the years, billions of people have bought and paid for a comprehensive system of water supply and disposal through the rates? When sites are sold off which people already own it is regarded as legalised theft. Is she aware that if the right hon. Member for Henley (Mr. Heseltine) had the guts to stand against her she would be swept from office and dumped with the garbage of her policies?
The Prime Minister
As the hon. Gentleman is aware, 25 per cent. of the water supply industry is already privatised. Even Socialist France knows that privatised water is a better deal than nationalised water. I hope that water privatisation will proceed successfully. The hon. Gentleman had better wait and see in the light of the facts rather than pontificate.
Mr. Gill
In view of the dramatic events unfolding in eastern Europe—[Interruption].
Mr. Speaker
Order. The hon. Member must ask a question about west Yorkshire.
Engagements
Q3. Mr. Wallace
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 28 November.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Wallace
As the Prime Minister in her interview last night said that in matters of government we should retain for ourselves the things we do best ourselves, will she give the Scottish people greater opportunities to govern themselves?
The Prime Minister
I believe that the Scottish people are best served by the present arrangements—the United Kingdom in the European Community and the continuance of the European Community as an organisation with maximum co-operation between sovereign nations.
Q4. Sir Patrick McNair-Wilson
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 28 November.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Sir Patrick McNair-Wilson
May I warmly congratulate my right hon. Friend on her successful meeting with President Bush at Camp David last Saturday? Will she tell the House that there is agreement between Britain, the United States and our European allies on the best approach to the historic changes taking place in eastern Europe?
[column 578]The Prime Minister
Yes, Mr. Speaker. For four and a half hours last week we had excellent discussions with President Bush at Camp David which showed a substantial identity of view on the way ahead for East-West relations. It is most important to secure democracy in all east European countries and throughout the Soviet Union, and not to raise the question of borders until that is complete. When it is complete there will be a different world and all sorts of things will be possible. Meantime NATO must be kept intact, our defence sure and negotiations between the Warsaw pact and NATO on the reductions of armaments must continue, giving us a basis of security for the enormous changes to take place to advantage.
Mr. Anderson
Why are there now many more young people begging on the streets of London and other big cities?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman is aware that if young people are in difficulty they can claim income support and housing benefit—[Interruption].
Mr. Speaker
Order.
The Prime Minister
For those between the ages of 16 and 18 there are more youth training places available than young people to fill them. The Government believe that it is better for young people to take up training than to be idle. If young people are in difficulty or facing hardship, special grants are available.
Q5. Mr. Jack
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 28 November.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Jack
What advice would my right hon. Friend give to the Vauxhall car workers at their plant in Ellesmere Port in Cheshire who, because of the action of Labour's acolytes—the Transport and General Workers Union—face the prospect of losing a £200 million engine plant development as a result of a damaging, selfish inter-union dispute on working premises?
The Prime Minister
Good jobs and good prospects come from working with and investing in equipment to its maximum extent. It is time for restrictive practices to go out of the window so that our labour costs become lower and our productivity higher, and so that we can compete with car manufacturers in Europe, Japan and the United States. Most ordinary trade unionists know that and I hope that they will pass that message on to their trade union leaders.
Mr. Radice
Can the Prime Minister tell the House whether she thinks there is a positive advantage for Britain in joining the exchange rate mechanism?
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to my speech at Madrid which laid down specific conditions to be met before we join the ERM. The first is that inflation must be got down. The second is that stage 1 of Delors with the necessary directives, together with the freeing of financial services, the freedom of capital movements plus the abolition of foreign exchange controls, must be met by other member countries, as they are being met by us. Moreover, we must get fair competition between countries. Hon. Members in most parts of the House accept that that is the right and proper way to proceed.
[column 579]6. Mr. Stanbrook
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 28 November.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Stanbrook
In response to some fancied labour shortage, the Government appear to want to encourage more mothers of young children to go out to work. Would it not be wiser—for the sake of the care, happiness and fostering of our children and of society—for mothers of young children to be encouraged to stay at home?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend is aware that it is for mothers themselves to decide. We do, indeed, need many more women at work, but it is for mothers to decide whether they can make full and proper arrangements for their children or whether they should wait until later, when their children are off their hands, to return to work. My hon. Friend knows that from next April, the taxation of married women will change and that they will be taxed separately. That will be a great advantage to them and will enable them to make their own choices.
Rev. Martin Smyth
Will the Prime Minister comment on recent developments in which the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland looked forward to entering discussions with Sinn Fein, whose aim is the British withdrawal from Northern Ireland, and on the weekend statement by Cardinal Ó Fiaich who asked for that intention to be declared?
The Prime Minister
As the hon. Gentleman is aware, Northern Ireland is, and remains, part of the United [column 580]Kingdom. That is the wish of the majority of her people and could be changed only if the wish of the majority changed and they did not want to stay with the United Kingdom, in which case it would be a matter not only for them but for hon. Members of this House. I hope and believe that Northern Ireland will remain a part of the United Kingdom.
Leeds
Q7. Mr. Kirkhope
To ask the Prime Minister if she will make an official visit to Leeds.
The Prime Minister
I have at present no plans to do so.
Mr. Kirkhope
Does not the recent announcement that the National Health Service executive and the social security directorate are to move to Leeds—with 2,000 members of staff—show the Government's true commitment to the interests of the people of the north of England? Does not it also provide further proof that Leeds and West Yorkshire are drawing people to them like a magnet?
The Prime Minister
I agree with my hon. Friend that the move of the Health Service executive and the social security directorate to Leeds is greatly to be welcomed. I believe that they will give a better service at less cost. They are fortunate to be able to move to that part of the world where they will have facilities which are much better than they are in London. I hope that the move will add much to the attraction of Leeds for others who may wish to move there.