6.50 pm
The Prime Minister
I shall reply in the few minutes available that I believe are sufficient because of the way in which the debate has gone. The House has generally supported the proposals that the Government have placed before the House.
I thank the right hon. Member for Leeds, East (Mr. Healey) for the tribute he paid to Lord Carrington for the excellent way in which he carried out his duties as Foreign Secretary and for his supreme integrity. I listened extremely carefully to what the right hon. Member for Leeds, East said about intelligence assessment. I shall follow that up from the viewpoint of a Minister and Prime Minister. I thank him for making it clear that the consultations between the Front Benches and the leaders of other parties had been fruitful and were largely responsible for coming to the agreement that we have broadly reached.
The right hon. Member for Glasgow, Hillhead (Mr. Jenkins) rather took me to task for referring initially to Government Departments in my reply to the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr. Grimond). The right hon. Gentleman will remember that he first asked me if I
“will order an inquiry into the conduct of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in recent years and the sufficiency of the advice and information supplied to Ministers.” —[Official Report, 8 April 1982, Vol. 21, c. 416.]
It was in reply to that question that I said that we would have to go wider into other Government Departments. A good deal of what was in that reply is in the terms of reference. When the answer was drafted, to me “Government Departments” obviously included “Ministers” . I saw afterwards that it might be taken to be an inquiry only into officials. That is why we changed it in the final terms of reference to the responsibilities of Government.
There have been some comments about the fetish of having inquiries by Privy Councillors. I have to consider not only the integrity of Privy Councillors and others, but the attitudes of the intelligence community and maintain its confidence that it is yielding its information to people of supreme integrity. Officials are governed by the Official Secrets Act. Ministers would be, but not necessarily those people who would be on an inquiry.
If we are to continue to obtain intelligence and protect its sources—to continue sometimes to obtain it from other countries—we must be certain that we do everything possible to protect it. It was for that reason that we were naturally led to a Committee of Privy Councillors. It makes it easier to secure the consent of those who have to [column 507]give such consent if Cabinet minutes and documents are to be revealed to the members of the inquiry. There was never any suggestion that Cabinet minutes and documents of one Administration should be revealed to another of a different political party, or even to another Administration whose members were not entitled to see them. The question arises as to what can be revealed to those who are on the inquiry. I was naturally anxious that we should reveal as much as possible, because if the inquiry is to be charged with the duty of finding the facts it must see as much of the evidence as possible. That is why we were led naturally to a Committee of Privy Councillors.
The 30-year rule has been criticised in some quarters of the House. I believe in that rule. It is a reasonable period, and if it were made much shorter we should soon find that Cabinet minutes and Cabinet Committee minutes would be drafted differently and would yield up far less information to future generations and fewer of the reasons that led us to take certain decisions.
I shall make one point about previous relevant information, although I thought that my right hon. Friend the Member for Spelthorne (Mr. Atkins) and my hon. Friend the Member for Wycombe (Mr. Whitney) put it extremely well. Other right hon. and hon. Members pointed out that a great deal of such information was already in the public domain but it is not possible to appreciate some of the decisions that were taken except by seeing them against a longer background.
With regard to a pledge of action that the right hon. Member for Leeds, East mentioned, it is a little early to talk about that before the review has even started. We shall have to see what it reports. It will have to come to the House for debate and perhaps we can take it from there.
Mr. David Winnick (Walsall, North)
rose——
[column 508]The Prime Minister
I must finish in three minutes.
With regard to the members of the inquiry, I have, as the right hon. Member for Leeds, East pointed out, been careful to choose those who have not had recent experience in the principal Departments concerned. I take issue with the right hon. Member for Leeds, East on what he said about natural justice. I have gone to great lengths to consult with many other right hon. and hon. Members on the terms of reference and on the composition of the inquiry and its general scope. I have made it perfectly clear that I shall very rarely make deletions.
Mr. Foulkes
rose——
The Prime Minister
My right hon. Friend the Member for Sidcup (Mr. Heath) made a point about intelligence. I have made it my business to ensure that the intelligence and security services have had sufficient resources to fulfil the requirements placed upon them.
As has been said, there are some drawbacks to every inquiry. I am anxious that we should reveal as much as possible and I believe that this is the right inquiry to choose and that that has been endorsed by the Leader of the Opposition and the leaders of the other political parties. I believe that it has had the general support of the House, and I ask the House to support it.
It being three hours after the commencement of proceedings on the motion, Mr. Speaker put the Question pursuant to the Order this day.
Question agree to.
Resolved.
That this House approves the decision of Her Majesty's Government to set up a Falkland Islands review as announced by the Prime Minister in her reply to a Question by the right hon. Gentleman, the Leader of the Opposition, on 6 July 1982.